Stand up, Sit Down, Fight Fight Fight!

[Polar33]

On Tuesday Cujo, Cujo's brother, LittleDollClaudia, and a mutual friend of Cujo and myself all went to the park to catch all the 50th entertainment offerings. We all had a great time, and I'll spare everyone the details for now, but there was one thing that I wanted to get everyone's opinion on.

Now, if you've been in the park since May 5th, I'm sure everyone can agree that the new fireworks show kicks ass, and that the best place to see it is in the Hub. I personally believe that the first time that someone sees the show they should see it under optimal viewing conditions. A person should be in a location where they have a good view of the castle, the Matterhorn, the Tink guide wire, and the launching area. Unfortunately, I can also attest, that true "optimal viewing conditions" involve having less then 500 other people in the Hub as well.

Let me set the scene; we were in the area north of the Hub and south of the Forecourt, slightly to the right of the drawbridge. An area that I rarely recommend watching the fireworks from due to crowding, but as I discovered during testing, it is the best location to see the show from. Since I had four first-time viewers with me I saw no other option.

We got there a little more than an hour before the show, and at the time there was an equal amount of people sitting and standing. Our group spend the next hour alternating between sitting and standing, as did much of the crowd. It wasn't until after the "lights out/safety/don't sue us" announcement that people started getting testy. It was a divided crowd, the sitters vs. the standers.

The sitters were the more vocal of the two groups...yelling and chanting at people "sit down", "down in front", etc. At one point a large group of sitters all yelled "sit down!" in unison, what they didn't expect I'm sure was the chorus of "stand up!" they got in return. As tense as it was at that moment I swear that I heard a few pings of laughter coming from both sides. The yelling continued well into the show's intro, but mostly died down to random comments throughout the show, except for the two ladies who were one step away from having a cat fight.

It should be noted at this point that our group was on the side of the standers. We were also the back of a group of standers, so we unfortunately got the brunt of the rudeness.

It should also be noted, that there are NO guidelines provided by GC on whether this should be a standing area or a seated area. And as one who has worked nights on the castle churro wagon more times then I'm willing to admit in public, this area has its nights were it's a standing crowd and it has it's nights were it's a sitting crowd, so there's no telling me that it's "always" one or the other.

After the show, the group discussed our complete lack of understanding why anyone in their right mind would want to sit down in that area. First off, the Castle itself was blocking a good portion of the low level pyro while standing up...seated you would miss several effects. Second, the show itself surrounds you, you can look around you a lot easier when standing. Third, from a logistic standpoint, you can fit WAY more people into the area when it's a standing crowd. And fourth, sitting on the ground for longer then 15 minutes starts to get painful, why cause yourself further discomfort during the show?

Just based on the fact that it would increase Hub capacity I think Disneyland needs make announcements and do whatever they can to keep people on their feet for the show. Additionally, if there were ever some form of emergency, standing crowds would evacuate a lot easier than sitting crowds. And if emergency services ever needed access to an area with a stretcher or something, a standing crowd would be easier to part.

So please, vote to let Cujo, LittleDollClaudia, and I know that we're not alone in thinking there is no point to sitting down for fireworks. Or, likewise if there is some benefit to being seated, please let us know as well...I'm honestly curious to know.

This post has been resubmitted due to a flaw in the polling system that we were unaware of. Those that have voted already, should vote again. Our apoligies for the trouble. -Polar33

[LiveWire]

well I've only seen the new fireworks from right in front of the castle and that is where the cms tell you that it is a seating area only. So when we yell at people to sit we're justified. :D:

But I've noticed the further back you are (from past firework experience)..the easier it is to stand because you may have trees or other things in the way. When I sit it's usually cause I'm tired of standing all day. But I think if the majority are sitting it's rude to stand and block views and if the majority are standing it's rude to tell everyone to sit. So.....its hard to say, just go with the flow I guess. If it's fifty fifty split...aww let em duke it out. :twisted:

I don't think there is much difference personally other than for me and my bad knees from dancing it's easier to sit sometimes then to stand if I have been on my feet all day. I think I can see just as well sitting or standing. But I usually chose to sit in the seated area cause it's easiest for me.

Hope that was as clear as mud for ya. :p:

[techie-13]

For me, it depends on where I can find a place to watch the show. I'm going to be there next week with some folks who have problems with standing for long periods so we will be looking for a good spot to sit down. My husband and I work on pyro crews so we are used to watching a fireworks show while standing, sitting or even laying down looking up. :D: I can understand both points of view regarding sitting or standing but I really don't think it's worth fighting over. Because of the anniversary hype, most folks (including me & hubby) are coming to the park for more than one night. So if you are in a spot one night where you can't see everything, just come back the next and pick another. No big deal! :rolleyes:
When I went to the MK at WDW with my family in 2000, I was amazed at how rude people were before and after the electrical parade or the fireworks. One guest even commented to me, "Geez, can you BELIEVE these people? They're in the Happiest Place on Earth, makes you wonder what they'd be like in a concentration camp!"

[lady ulrike]

"Geez, can you BELIEVE these people? They're in the Happiest Place on Earth, makes you wonder what they'd be like in a concentration camp!"

I gotta say, I like this line, think I could get away with saying it in costume, on stage?? :)

[abc]

I personally am much more comfortable standing. It should only be sitting from the front row on back to the curb infront of the castle. The sole fact that standing guests take up like 1/3rd the space should be enough to institute a standing room only policy. If I am working pyro GC at the castle and there are like 5 people standing infront of hundreds sitting i WILL make the standing people sit down.

Besides if you have to sit on the main street horses pathway during the fireworks who knows what has happpened to that concrete over the course of the day :horseappl

[techie-13]

Besides if you have to sit on the main street horses pathway during the fireworks who knows what has happpened to that concrete over the course of the day :horseappl

I came across a few guests during my visit that I think should sit on that concrete! :twisted:

[GMC]

i've seen it both sitting and standing
i like my spot from in from of the frontierland entrace in the hub, where i stood. I sat in the forecourt once, but the low range effects were obstraced by the castle and my angle, and tink spent alot of time behind the center turret, however i was able to see everythign the castle was doing.

[kimpossible33]

I at first thought people should stand, then I thought of how hard it would be for shorter people, children, and people sitting in wheelchairs. Well, I couldn't say they should sit, considering I know a lot of people who can't sit! I remember watching Believe when a woman beside me was the only one standing up and people were yelling at her to sit down, but she obviously couldn't, so she started to walk towards the side (where she would have a terrible view). So I just stood up, with my sisters, and, after a bit more yelling, people just stopped caring. So I don't think there should be a set rule or whatever. I can't think of any other reasons though.

[lady ulrike]

My cousing was telling me yesterday that one time they were standing and waiting for the fireworks and a group came and sat behind them. When the fireworks started they started yelling at them to sit down. That, I think, was completely uncalled for, I mean they were standing when that group got there and sat down, it would be different if they stood up when the fireworks started.

[Fantasmic_Freak]

Originally Posted by abc
Besides if you have to sit on the main street horses pathway during the fireworks who knows what has happpened to that concrete over the course of the day

Yah totally, i am usually forced to sit there because of walkway blocking, if youve been there an hour before and its the best spot, oh well! I am usually the first to sit in the middle of main street on days when i am there, love the comments from the double wide strollers trying to go the wrong way. But it is really a toss up on what cm you get for your area, most people back there say stand up. someone, new gc rule #1,155 stand around hub, sit in forecort and compass, stand down main street.

[Stduck]

Out on Enterances in Fantasmic! Yellow I was by info board. There is this roped off area with benches and the ugly planter (its called that in the Fantasmic OG) and I was there keeping the walkway clear. This man comes up to me demanding I make the people in front of the benches sit. Alas there are no rules so I don't have to.

Disney needs to make some STAND UP rules.

[lady ulrike]

Ok, I had a situation for this for the parade yesterday. It's almost parade time and a woman calls me over, so I go see what's going on. Her group is sitting and she asks me, "Are you going to make these people sit?" I told her that there's no rule for this area, so no I wasn't. We had to go back and forth a couple of times, and she got almost beligerent. So, when I left I told the lead who then hung out in that area for the parade in case there was a problem (it was by our crossing area) The thing is, the people standing in front of them had been there a really long time and well before these people. Also they were standing that whole time. Why are you going to sit down behind someone standing and expect that they're going to sit later???

[Andoo]

Many people in the park, standing up is more economical. It's also hard for older people to sit down on the hard pavement. It's not just little kids that attend the park. That’s the way I see it =/

[CA Screamin Dude]

People should stand for Remember - you have to look up anyway, might as well be closer to the actual show...

[Natural Selection Fan]

Whip 'em down! Beat 'em down! And keep 'em down!!!!!

It's downright theraputic.

[sandravb79]

I think people should stand. First of all, that way you can accomodate more people, and secondly, it's safer. In case something happens, and you need to evacuate, the "sitters" will otherwise be crushed. And oh, sitting on a cold ground is not healthy (especially true for girls/ women!)

I always wonder why people can't stand on their feet to watch a parade/ Fantasmic/ fireworks... but that's just me.

[SpamPutney]

And oh, sitting on a cold ground is not healthy (especially true for girls/ women!)



I'm very curious why this is. Call me ignorant, but I have no idea what you are talking about.

[Main Streeter]

I'm very curious why this is. Call me ignorant, but I have no idea what you are talking about.This leaves me blank also. Maybe a cultural thing? :confused:

[sandravb79]

This leaves me blank also. Maybe a cultural thing? :confused:

It's not a cultural thing (for chrissake, I'm from Europe, here everything is allowed, LOL!)

It's called cystitis... yes indeed, sitting on a could ground increases the risk you get it.

[Main Streeter]

It's not a cultural thing (for chrissake, I'm from Europe, here everything is allowed, LOL!)

It's called cystitis... yes indeed, sitting on a could ground increases the risk you get it.
Well, I've just displayed my medical ignorance. :o: Am a prime candidate for cystitis. Not the worst worry in my world. :D: Thanks for the clarification.

[sandravb79]

You're welcome

[Stduck]

I always wonder why people can't stand on their feet to watch a parade/ Fantasmic/ fireworks... but that's just me.

For the Parade its a safety thing that you must have at least the first row sitting (its harder to get up and run out to get hit by floats) in certain areas is a favor to the guests who got there early for benches. Fantasmic, so more people can see (Sitting sections infront of standing). For the Fireworks we have started about 10 minutes before start time asking the guests to stand up and step forward.

[LittleDollClaudia]

Okay, I took my roommate on Nov.11 to Disneyland. (Veteran's Day, oy the suffering) Anyway, we were able to find seating in front of the castle an hour before the show. Now here's the issue. The family next to us had a stroller and Grandma lying down on a blanket. The stroller I understood but lying down?!?!? They proceeded to make snarky comments for almost the entire wait time.(Example:"Imagine people coming in here five minutes before the show and thinking they will get a seat in here. I'm not giving up my spot for them." As it was we were right at the rope limit so when others tried to sneak under these people would raise holy hell and scream for a CM to come over. "This area is full.", they would whine to whomever would listen. Waahhh...give me a break. My favorite part of this was a guest who came by right before the show started. She went under the ropes with her two kids and was immediately scolded by the family. Then a CM came by and told her she had to move. "Why? Did they pay extra to sit there?" the lady said in an offended tone. "No. But they have been sitting there for about three hours for the show." The CM tells her. They lady looks at the group and says,"That's their own damn problem." She was escorted away by the CM at this point. Now, I did see guests lined up with blankets and such about three hours before the show. Now, I ask all of you...When is it too early to seat for a show? And do you think that guests who do this should have special privileges? Because the ones we were seated next to obviously thought so. Also, what about the laying down thing? I saw several guests doing this and it wasn't to save a space. Am I being too anal on this subject? I welcome your opinions. I do have to add though, sitting there was not the best way to see everything. When Polar and Cujo and I went it was a much better view even with the BS comments behind us. Go figure that one out.

[ameryth74]

I think it depends on the eyeline... there should be seating areas and standing areas... but the CM's actually need to be able to enforce them...

but what I really think (in my drug induced hallucinations...lol) is that the entire hub should rise out the ground on hydrolics bringing up from underground with it "bleachers" or "stadium style seating" that sit beneath the "canopy" that is the hub... kinda like that stage in tomorrowland...lol... and for those people further down main street... the back of the seating would have a giant projection screen of the castle (live) so they too could see all the neat details on the castle (since they can't see them due to the trees in the hub anyway). Guests could sit (only) on the ground/street in front of this monstrosity...lol, stand on the sides and down main street, or pay money to sit in the premium seats like the fantastmic people do...lol.

[Walt Disney]

Actually, the proper respose to this is:

REMAIN SEATED, PLEASE! CINNAMON TOAST AND TACOS, POR FAVOR!

[Stduck]

Actually, the proper respose to this is:

REMAIN SEATED, PLEASE! CINNAMON TOAST AND TACOS, POR FAVOR!

On the floor.

[IndyandMarion]

This didn't happen at DL, but at WDW for Wishes. I was there with a group of friends last night actually waiting for Wishes. We were passing through the hub area trying to find what little room was left for the size of our group (Nine people, 7 of them showed up late so there's the reason for the last minute hunt).

Well we're standing in the street and about that time, every person with a stroller decides to come by us and yell at us for standing in the way. Mind you, there isn't a sign or anyone directing people toward our area, but we move forward a little to get them to shut up.

But the real fun came moments later. As we're continuing to look for a spot, these idiots behind us, sitting down, yell at us to move and we all turn around and basically tell them we're working on moving.

*Mind you, there are no signs saying this is a standing or sitting area*

*Please note: Words were exchange. No profanity. No shots were taken.*

Few moments later, they yell at us and I finally get into it. Well, that lead to some dude in a group who thought he would try and intimidate us because of his "size" and gets right up on my friend who is like a brother. The guy gets a little close and I step in front of the guy, put my arm up to block the guy and get into it with him.

*Good ol' security, two feet away, watching the whole thing*

"Bra, we're working on moving so back off."

"We've been waiting here for an hour! You need to sit down!"

"ALL RIGHT! THAT'S ENOUGH! I JUST TOLD YOU WE'RE TRYING TO MOVE SO EASE OFF BEFORE SOMETHING ELSE HAPPENS! THE FIREWORKS ARE IN THE SKY SO WHAT THE WORLD IS YOUR PROBLEM? I HAVE YET TO SEE A SIGN THAT SAYS THIS IS A SITTING AREA. IF YOU'RE GOING AFTER US, THEN GO AFTER ALL OF THESE OTHER PEOPLE THAT ARE STANDING."

*This time, about a 70 year old woman from the group walks over*

"You want hit a handicap person" (That I didn't get.)

"No. BUT THIS GUY WILL BE IF HE DOESN'T BACK OFF!"

*The woman proceeds to grab my arm*

"Get your hand off me right now."

*Security guy walks in*

"Are you finished?"

This is when myself and my brother lost it because the guard said that to us. By this point, the rest of the group had moved off to the side. But the two of us stood there and continued to finish this. We did. We left and went to Guest Relations to complain about the guard doing nothing but dogging us, then the two of us left the park. About twenty minutes later, the rest of the group calls and says they did the same thing.

Here's the kicker. One of the girl's in the group, yeah, her father is a manager in the Main Street area. Also on hand when the rest of the group reported this guy, was our old area manager over in sunset. Every person in the group, he knew. The two of us found out later in that same call, that the guy was apparently fired on the spot.

[mechurchlady]

I cannot go back to DLR again. I remember then warm nights when I and others would find a spot by It's a Small World and lay down. I am disabled so I am a sitter but there is a difference depending where you are in a park. I have seen fireworks on the back of the Mark Twain and all over DLR.

The fights are not as bad as the rude guests. They do the trampede over everyone. After fireworks you better not be sitting on the ground. I had a lady actually step on my lap while I was finishing my dinner. I feel sorry for the cast members and the little kids who get run down by rude guests.

What is worst is what you mentioned about the chanting and fighting. This is supposed to be a happy calm time when you watch the pretty fireworks. What if people were at the opera or movie theater chanting and yelling over something.

I love your site and joined so I could keep laughing. Time to go now and uh where is the exit? Oh below the sign that in neon says EXIT.

[darph nader]

NOO, the exit is to your right,no,your other right.(two finger point). :cool:

[CujoSR]

Bringing up old threads but I had to show this!!!

http://lads.myspace.com/06_03/MS-60313-13-TRIB-AJ/v3/x54a.gif